First of all: what is this thing? Is it some kind of system to play movies in presentations etc? In that case: great!
Then: It claims support for a dozen different media formats, such as: AIF audio AU audio AVI CD audio MIDI audio MPEG Audio MPEG Video Quictime video Vivo video WAVE audo Is this correct? How does it play contnent? The best would probably be gstreamer (adding a gstreamer plugin would then make it work in openoffice, totem etc.).
It is found in (writer as example) Tools -> Media Player
Kyrre Ness Sjøbæk
Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote:
First of all: what is this thing? Is it some kind of system to play movies in presentations etc? In that case: great!
Then: It claims support for a dozen different media formats, such as: AIF audio AU audio AVI CD audio MIDI audio MPEG Audio MPEG Video Quictime video Vivo video WAVE audo
no ogg-vorbis ?
Is this correct? How does it play contnent? The best would probably be gstreamer (adding a gstreamer plugin would then make it work in openoffice, totem etc.).
It is found in (writer as example) Tools -> Media Player
-> open -> /usr/share/sounds/*.wav "the format of the selected file is not supported" :-(
On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 15:16 +0200, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote:
First of all: what is this thing? Is it some kind of system to play movies in presentations etc? In that case: great!
Yup.
Is this correct? How does it play contnent? The best would probably be gstreamer (adding a gstreamer plugin would then make it work in openoffice, totem etc.).
It's implemented using the windows media api on win32 and the java media framework on everything else. There are some problems with it:
http://www.oooforum.org/forum/viewtopic.phtml?t=17635
A gstreamer-based implementation would be a much better way to go since the java media stuff is not that great and it seems like it's not being maintained very well. Porting to gstreamer could be a lot of work, but maybe the gstreamer people are better at estimating that...
Klaasjan
On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 17:57 +0200, Klaasjan Brand wrote:
A gstreamer-based implementation would be a much better way to go since the java media stuff is not that great and it seems like it's not being maintained very well. Porting to gstreamer could be a lot of work, but maybe the gstreamer people are better at estimating that...
GStreamer would be better anyway because it appears to be the chosen media framework for gnome, and since it supports plugins - vendors that do not wish to license patented codecs (like Fedora) don't have to, the end user can simply install the plugins as needed.
GStreamer is definitely the best way to do it.
Rather than port what they have to GStreamer, maybe it would be better to start fresh and hook into totem - kind of like the totem mozilla plugin is doing (anyone tried that recently??)
Alternatively - there are Python gstreamer bindings and perl gstreamer bindings that might be good enough to just do it that way, which would probably be more portable (if it's fast enough)
I haven't seen the OO.o media player, I don't use it - so maybe I'm just blowing wind.
Em Sáb, 2005-04-30 às 16:20 -0700, Michael A. Peters escreveu:
Rather than port what they have to GStreamer, maybe it would be better to start fresh and hook into totem - kind of like the totem mozilla plugin is doing (anyone tried that recently??)
As far as I can recall, totem for mozilla depends on xine, isn't it?
On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 21:02 -0300, Alexandre Strube wrote:
Em Sáb, 2005-04-30 às 16:20 -0700, Michael A. Peters escreveu:
Rather than port what they have to GStreamer, maybe it would be better to start fresh and hook into totem - kind of like the totem mozilla plugin is doing (anyone tried that recently??)
As far as I can recall, totem for mozilla depends on xine, isn't it?
Totem can use xine as it's backend, but it also can use gstreamer. It's a compile time option and while totem used to default to xine in the past, the current versions are set up to use gstreamer (including the versions of totem in FC4 and GNOME-2.10) since gstreamer has grown up enough to be a viable backend.
Rodd
Le dimanche 01 mai 2005 à 22:06 +1000, Rodd Clarkson a écrit : <snip>
since gstreamer has grown up enough to be a viable backend.
Now that is what I call a subjective opinion...
When totem and gstreamer are capable of playing back DVB (live TV and recordings) out of the box I will say they are grown up enough for me. When it knows that I have dvdcss installed and play MPAA crippled DVDs I will say viable.
Until that day xine (which also has xxmc mpeg2 acceleration on my machine) will stay player of choice.
Cheers
Tony
On Mon, 2005-05-02 at 07:45 +0200, tony wrote:
Le dimanche 01 mai 2005 à 22:06 +1000, Rodd Clarkson a écrit :
<snip>
since gstreamer has grown up enough to be a viable backend.
Now that is what I call a subjective opinion...
Sure, the world's full of subjective opinions. Of course, I didn't say that gstreamer was perfect, I just said that it had grown up enough to be a viable backend. Given that this is the direction that GNOME, Fedora and it would appear KDE are keen to take in terms of handing media formats it's probably fair to say that you'll have to endure gstreamer while it is 'fixed', or use some none fedora supplied alternative.
When totem and gstreamer are capable of playing back DVB (live TV and recordings) out of the box I will say they are grown up enough for me. When it knows that I have dvdcss installed and play MPAA crippled DVDs I will say viable.
I play DVD's (region encoded, dvdcss protected) at the moment and playback is quite good. One of the really nice things about gstreamer is that the media formats are handled using plugins, so Fedora can supply the formats it feels comfortable in using and you can easily add other formats as you need.
A good place to look for this is the gstreamer website (http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/) Add the necessary yum repo information and then install those extra bits that gstreamer doesn't come with on fedora. I'm using the FC3 repo on the gstreamer site with FC4T1 (updated to current) and it's working quite well.
Until that day xine (which also has xxmc mpeg2 acceleration on my machine) will stay player of choice.
I don't know how xine compares, but as I understand it adding support for other formats/codecs requires a rebuild in xine which makes it quite awkward for the needs of Fedora, Redhat and other distributions who do not want to supply no-free formats, but who are trying not to make it hard for users to add, by themselves, after the install.
Xine certainly had a jump start on gstreamer, but I believe that gstreamer tries to do a little more than xine in terms of functionality. Regardless, with GNOME using is for the media backend and KDE very seriously looking at it (offering the chance at a unified media framework across desktops - a Good Thing (TM) in my opinion*) Fedora would be made to ignore it.
Rodd
* see the comments regarding opinions at the top of the reply. ;-]
On Mon, 2005-05-02 at 16:08 +1000, Rodd Clarkson wrote: [snip]
I play DVD's (region encoded, dvdcss protected) at the moment and playback is quite good. One of the really nice things about gstreamer is that the media formats are handled using plugins, so Fedora can supply the formats it feels comfortable in using and you can easily add other formats as you need.
A good place to look for this is the gstreamer website (http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/) Add the necessary yum repo information and then install those extra bits that gstreamer doesn't come with on fedora.
Do I understand you correctly that the lack of certain gstreamer plugins is the reason why Totem on my up2date FC4T2 box won't play any video file (mpg, avi, wmv, mov)?
I'm using the FC3 repo on the gstreamer site with FC4T1 (updated to current) and it's working quite well.
[snip]
Exactly which packages did you install from the gstreamer yum repo? I'd love to get this functionality back like I had with FC3 and mplayer.
TIA, Patrick
On Mon, 2005-05-02 at 11:04 +0200, Patrick wrote:
A good place to look for this is the gstreamer website (http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/) Add the necessary yum repo information and then install those extra bits that gstreamer doesn't come with on fedora.
Do I understand you correctly that the lack of certain gstreamer plugins is the reason why Totem on my up2date FC4T2 box won't play any video file (mpg, avi, wmv, mov)?
Totem as shipped by Fedora never included the capability to playback those formats. Maybe you replaced it with a version using Xine as a back-end?
I'm using the FC3 repo on the gstreamer site with FC4T1 (updated to current) and it's working quite well.
[snip]
Exactly which packages did you install from the gstreamer yum repo? I'd love to get this functionality back like I had with FC3 and mplayer.
You can try the gstreamer-ffmpeg module (not packaged in an easy way afaik) or replace Totem with Totem-xine. (see rpm.livna.org)
Klaasjan
Le lundi 02 mai 2005 à 13:47 +0200, Klaasjan Brand a écrit :
Totem on my up2date FC4T2 box won't play any video
file (mpg, avi, wmv, mov)?
Totem as shipped by Fedora never included the capability to playback those formats. Maybe you replaced it with a version using Xine as a back-end?
What does totem actually play? It does not seem capable of playing any media I have available.
You can try the gstreamer-ffmpeg module (not packaged in an easy way afaik) or replace Totem with Totem-xine. (see rpm.livna.org)
I have an even better solution: xine with a xine front end... Everything else comes from livna and dag yum repositories (ffmpeg, dvd..., libfoo...).
I use VDR and vdr-xine (budget DVB-S card) so I have to patch xine and compile it anyway:
- apply vdr-xine patch by copy pasting instructions from INSTALL - ./autogen.sh - make - make install
10 minutes later (1Ghz VIA) I can watch live TV - DVB button, recorded or time shifted or more live TV - VDR button, DVD etc. ad nauseum.
On the other hand we have totem which with gstreamer (last time I tried that it sucked all life from my CPU) plays - nothing!
This is tongue in cheek but IMVHO a decent HOWTO get and install something that just works now and today is much more useful to the end user than something that may be taken up by KDE and become the standard in the we don't know when futur. I does put into perspective all the stupid hoops US patents and DCMA and whatever laws makes Redhat have to jump through.
And by the way, the totem interface is as ugly as sin. (Just had to get that out of my system)
Cheers
Tony
On Mon, 2005-05-02 at 14:19 +0200, tony wrote:
Totem as shipped by Fedora never included the capability to playback those formats. Maybe you replaced it with a version using Xine as a back-end?
What does totem actually play? It does not seem capable of playing any media I have available.
Totem is just the player front-end and will only play whatever the back- end is able to play. Fedora Totem uses gstreamer which is only able to play unpatented formats, which means no mp3, no mpeg, no divx. It does play ogg audio and maybe ogg theora video. It's also capable of reading from a video4linux source (webcam, tv card).
You can try the gstreamer-ffmpeg module (not packaged in an easy way afaik) or replace Totem with Totem-xine. (see rpm.livna.org)
I have an even better solution: xine with a xine front end... Everything else comes from livna and dag yum repositories (ffmpeg, dvd..., libfoo...).
Of course you can use something else.
On the other hand we have totem which with gstreamer (last time I tried that it sucked all life from my CPU) plays - nothing!
But is totally patent-free ;)
But really: there's a lot of effort going into gstreamer and it's really working if you have the right codecs. If you want you may even file bugs ;). One of the big advantages a unified media framework gives you is that all a/v applications can use the installed codecs. Which means in the long run less work for you (compiling, installing etc).
This is tongue in cheek but IMVHO a decent HOWTO get and install something that just works now and today is much more useful to the end user than something that may be taken up by KDE and become the standard in the we don't know when futur. I does put into perspective all the stupid hoops US patents and DCMA and whatever laws makes Redhat have to jump through.
And by the way, the totem interface is as ugly as sin. (Just had to get that out of my system)
Ugly as in "uses sane widgets and menu's"? Personally I like it a lot more than the "skinnable" media players; they always seem to have a lot of tiny buttons and waste screen space for graphics.
Klaasjan
What does totem actually play? It does not seem capable of playing any media I have available.
Totem is just the player front-end and will only play whatever the back- end is able to play. Fedora Totem uses gstreamer which is only able to play unpatented formats, which means no mp3, no mpeg, no divx. It does play ogg audio and maybe ogg theora video. It's also capable of reading from a video4linux source (webcam, tv card).
Just to clear any confusion here, gstreamer is capable of playing most formats. The version included in Fedora is limited to just open formats. Any format with dubious patents or licenses isn't included, but that's a fedora decision.
Luckily, the gstreamer guys have compiled the rpms for gstreamer into a selection of packages that seperate the free codecs from the patented ones, which means you don't have to do much more than add the non-free ones to get support for them in Fedora.
<snip>
And by the way, the totem interface is as ugly as sin. (Just had to get that out of my system)
Ugly as in "uses sane widgets and menu's"? Personally I like it a lot more than the "skinnable" media players; they always seem to have a lot of tiny buttons and waste screen space for graphics.
I agree. Each to his own. Personally I love that totem is so plain that it's not a distraction.
Rodd
Em Ter, 2005-05-03 às 20:08 +1000, Rodd Clarkson escreveu:
Luckily, the gstreamer guys have compiled the rpms for gstreamer into a selection of packages that seperate the free codecs from the patented ones, which means you don't have to do much more than add the non-free ones to get support for them in Fedora.
Even using those rpms, totem is still not that well-behaved. I just had to reinstall mplayer so I could see some videos which woulnd't work with totem correctly (strang sound, crappy video)
On Tue, 2005-05-03 at 08:40 -0300, Alexandre Strube wrote:
Em Ter, 2005-05-03 às 20:08 +1000, Rodd Clarkson escreveu:
Luckily, the gstreamer guys have compiled the rpms for gstreamer into a selection of packages that seperate the free codecs from the patented ones, which means you don't have to do much more than add the non-free ones to get support for them in Fedora.
Even using those rpms, totem is still not that well-behaved. I just had to reinstall mplayer so I could see some videos which woulnd't work with totem correctly (strang sound, crappy video)
Of course - and it goes without saying - please file bug reports for these files against the related gstreamer packages. This will help gstreamer become all that you wish it would be.
Rodd
On Mon, 2005-05-02 at 14:19 +0200, tony wrote:
Le lundi 02 mai 2005 à 13:47 +0200, Klaasjan Brand a écrit :
You can try the gstreamer-ffmpeg module (not packaged in an easy way afaik) or replace Totem with Totem-xine. (see rpm.livna.org)
I have an even better solution: xine with a xine front end... Everything else comes from livna and dag yum repositories (ffmpeg, dvd..., libfoo...).
"Better solution"? Short term yes. But long term no.
Trust me, have a look at the gstreamer architecture. I'm a Xine fan, i use it all the time, i tell other people to use it and i contributed a little to the project, and yes, currently seems to be the overall best player. But gstreamer is so much more than just a media player. It's like Xine + Enix (remember Enix? the now-dead twin of xine that was aiming to provide an encoding platform) plus a lot more. It's still in a pretty early stage, while Xine is a mature project, therefore it's normal that Xine is currently better for end-users.
And by the way, the totem interface is as ugly as sin. (Just had to get that out of my system)
Well, both xine and gstreamer allow you to use any arbitrary interface you like. You can even write your own. ;-)
On Mon, 2005-05-02 at 13:47 +0200, Klaasjan Brand wrote: [snip]
Totem as shipped by Fedora never included the capability to playback those formats. Maybe you replaced it with a version using Xine as a back-end?
Makes me wonder what it actually can play :)
You can try the gstreamer-ffmpeg module (not packaged in an easy way afaik) or replace Totem with Totem-xine. (see rpm.livna.org)
Will give both a try. Thanks for the tip.
Regards, Patrick
Do I understand you correctly that the lack of certain gstreamer plugins is the reason why Totem on my up2date FC4T2 box won't play any video file (mpg, avi, wmv, mov)?
Probably.
I'm using the FC3 repo on the gstreamer site with FC4T1 (updated to current) and it's working quite well.
[snip]
Exactly which packages did you install from the gstreamer yum repo? I'd love to get this functionality back like I had with FC3 and mplayer.
I've got the following installed:
gstreamer.i386 0.8.9-4 installed gstreamer-devel.i386 0.8.9-4 installed gstreamer-editor.i386 0.8.0-0.fdr.1.3 installed gstreamer-ffmpeg.i386 0.8.4-0.lvn.1.3 installed gstreamer-monkeysaudio.i386 0.8.0-0.lvn.1.3 installed gstreamer-plugins.i386 0.8.8-5 installed gstreamer-plugins-audio.i386 0.8.8-0.fdr.1.3 installed gstreamer-plugins-devel.i386 0.8.8-5 installed gstreamer-plugins-extra-audio.i386 0.8.8-0.lvn.1.3 installed gstreamer-plugins-extra-dvd.i386 0.8.8-0.lvn.1.3 installed gstreamer-plugins-extra-video.i386 0.8.8-0.lvn.1.3 installed gstreamer-plugins-video.i386 0.8.8-0.fdr.1.3 installed gstreamer-tools.i386 0.8.9-4 installed
Some of these are Fedora, the rest are from gstreamer-gst.
Rodd
On Mon, 2005-05-02 at 16:08 +1000, Rodd Clarkson wrote:
Xine certainly had a jump start on gstreamer, but I believe that gstreamer tries to do a little more than xine in terms of functionality. Regardless, with GNOME using is for the media backend and KDE very seriously looking at it (offering the chance at a unified media framework across desktops - a Good Thing (TM) in my opinion*) Fedora would be made to ignore it.
Fully agree.
I'm a bit of a Xine fan myself, and i think that currently it still is the "overall best" media player (on par with mplayer for regular media files, plus it handles DVDs a lot better). But definitely gstreamer has a better architecture.
There's no need for bashing either project. Both are great. Just use whatever suits your needs.
My feeling is that gstreamer will legitimately become the media player of choice for the majority of users at some point in the future. It's just a matter of time until all the major media formats are handled by gstreamer plugins.
On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 15:16 +0200, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote:
First of all: what is this thing? Is it some kind of system to play movies in presentations etc? In that case: great!
Then: It claims support for a dozen different media formats, such as: AIF audio AU audio AVI CD audio MIDI audio MPEG Audio MPEG Video Quictime video Vivo video WAVE audo Is this correct? How does it play contnent? The best would probably be gstreamer (adding a gstreamer plugin would then make it work in openoffice, totem etc.).
It is found in (writer as example) Tools -> Media Player
Kyrre Ness Sjøbæk
Hello,
Where do you find this OpenOffice Media Player?
Jeff
lør, 30.04.2005 kl. 21.35 skrev Jeffrey D. Yuille:
On Sat, 2005-04-30 at 15:16 +0200, Kyrre Ness Sjobak wrote:
First of all: what is this thing? Is it some kind of system to play movies in presentations etc? In that case: great!
Then: It claims support for a dozen different media formats, such as: AIF audio AU audio AVI CD audio MIDI audio MPEG Audio MPEG Video Quictime video Vivo video WAVE audo Is this correct? How does it play contnent? The best would probably be gstreamer (adding a gstreamer plugin would then make it work in openoffice, totem etc.).
It is found in (writer as example) Tools -> Media Player
Kyrre Ness Sjøbæk
Hello, Where do you find this OpenOffice Media Player?Jeff
Open (example) writer Tools menu Media Player
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