From Rawhide to Moonshine

[Oliver Ruebenacker]

Dear friends,

I am sure some one has asked this before, but I can not find it: If
I am on F6.93 Rawhide with regular updates and want to shift to F7
Moonshine, what do I need to do? Will it update automatically into the
release version, or will I continue on Rawhide if I do not interfere
with the updates? If I want to end up with the F7 Moonshine release
version, do I need to: (a) do nothing, let the updater do its job (b)
modify the updater (c) boot from an install disk (d) take some other
action. Thanks!

Take care
     Oliver

[Will Woods]

On Thu, 2007-05-31 at 11:29 -0400, Oliver Ruebenacker wrote:
> Dear friends,
>
> I am sure some one has asked this before, but I can not find it: If
> I am on F6.93 Rawhide with regular updates and want to shift to F7
> Moonshine, what do I need to do? Will it update automatically into the
> release version, or will I continue on Rawhide if I do not interfere
> with the updates? If I want to end up with the F7 Moonshine release
> version, do I need to: (a) do nothing, let the updater do its job (b)
> modify the updater (c) boot from an install disk (d) take some other
> action. Thanks!

(d).

Install the fedora-release package from Moonshine, which will change
your repo files to point to the Moonshine repos, and update normally.

-w

[Niels Weber]

Hi,

2007/5/31, Oliver Ruebenacker :
> I am sure some one has asked this before, but I can not find it: If
> I am on F6.93 Rawhide with regular updates and want to shift to F7
> Moonshine, what do I need to do? Will it update automatically into the
> release version, or will I continue on Rawhide if I do not interfere
> with the updates? If I want to end up with the F7 Moonshine release
> version, do I need to: (a) do nothing, let the updater do its job (b)
> modify the updater (c) boot from an install disk (d) take some other
> action. Thanks!

considering that regular updating today will already take you past F7
and into the new Rawhide, it seems safe to say that you have to do
something. I am not sure what though. I guess, one can get a
fedora-release RPM somewhere what will do the job?

Niels

[Gianluca Sforna]

On 5/31/07, Niels Weber  wrote:
> Hi,
>
> 2007/5/31, Oliver Ruebenacker :
> > I am sure some one has asked this before, but I can not find it: If
> > I am on F6.93 Rawhide with regular updates and want to shift to F7
> > Moonshine, what do I need to do? Will it update automatically into the
> > release version, or will I continue on Rawhide if I do not interfere
> > with the updates? If I want to end up with the F7 Moonshine release
> > version, do I need to: (a) do nothing, let the updater do its job (b)
> > modify the updater (c) boot from an install disk (d) take some other
> > action. Thanks!
>
> considering that regular updating today will already take you past F7
> and into the new Rawhide, it seems safe to say that you have to do
> something. I am not sure what though. I guess, one can get a
> fedora-release RPM somewhere what will do the job?

this should do:
http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/releases/7/Fedora/i386/os...

[cornel panceac]

however there's something i'm not sure of: the pre-realease versions ofthe
packages are compiled with debugging afaik, so just updating the
fedora-release wil not imho get rid of debugging symbols, right? and until
_all_ the old packages are updated there will still be a performance penalty
....

2007/5/31, Gianluca Sforna :
> On 5/31/07, Niels Weber  wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > 2007/5/31, Oliver Ruebenacker :
> > > I am sure some one has asked this before, but I can not find it: If
> > > I am on F6.93 Rawhide with regular updates and want to shift to F7
> > > Moonshine, what do I need to do? Will it update automatically into the
> > > release version, or will I continue on Rawhide if I do not interfere
> > > with the updates? If I want to end up with the F7 Moonshine release
> > > version, do I need to: (a) do nothing, let the updater do its job (b)
> > > modify the updater (c) boot from an install disk (d) take some other
> > > action. Thanks!
> >
> > considering that regular updating today will already take you past F7
> > and into the new Rawhide, it seems safe to say that you have to do
> > something. I am not sure what though. I guess, one can get a
> > fedora-release RPM somewhere what will do the job?
>
> this should do:
>
> http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/releases/7/Fedora/i386/os...
>
> --
> fedora-test-list mailing list
> [e-mail]
> To unsubscribe:
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list

[Niels Weber]

2007/5/31, cornel panceac :
> however there's something i'm not sure of: the pre-realease versions ofthe
> packages are compiled with debugging afaik, so just updating the
> fedora-release wil not imho get rid of debugging symbols, right? and until
> _all_ the old packages are updated there will still be a performance penalty

I thought the debug symbols were turned off again in the last run of
updates before the release? yum shows no updates after updating the
fedora-release, had the packages changed in between, there would have
been new versions, wouldn't there?

Niels

[Jesse Keating]

On Thursday 31 May 2007 12:02:53 Niels Weber wrote:
> I thought the debug symbols were turned off again in the last run of
> updates before the release? yum shows no updates after updating the
> fedora-release, had the packages changed in between, there would have
> been new versions, wouldn't there?

The path that rawhide gets published to changed, but before a new 
fedora-release was issued to reference said new path.  chicken/egg issue 
(sortof).

Rawhide is now pub/fedora/linux/development/<arch>/os

[Gianluca Sforna]

On 5/31/07, cornel panceac  wrote:
> however there's something i'm not sure of: the pre-realease versions ofthe
> packages are compiled with debugging afaik, so just updating the
> fedora-release wil not imho get rid of debugging symbols, right? and until
> _all_ the old packages are updated there will still be a performance penalty

I don't think this is exact. AFAIK, the packages are always built with
the same compiler flags, so yes, debugging symbols are added (but you
won't notice since they are stored in -debuginfo packages) but no,
there is no performance penalty since the optimization are active.

The only minor(?) excepton to this is the kernel, where I think there
is some debugging stuff active in rawhide affecting performances.

[cornel panceac]

hmm, this is good and bad news in the same time. this means my
celeron/533mhz/320mibRAM will still be slow even after switching tfrom f7t4
o f7 .....
thnx anyway :)

2007/6/1, Gianluca Sforna :
> On 5/31/07, cornel panceac  wrote:
> > however there's something i'm not sure of: the pre-realease versions
>
> ofthe
> > packages are compiled with debugging afaik, so just updating the
> > fedora-release wil not imho get rid of debugging symbols, right? and
>
> until
> > _all_ the old packages are updated there will still be a performance
>
> penalty
>
> I don't think this is exact. AFAIK, the packages are always built with
> the same compiler flags, so yes, debugging symbols are added (but you
> won't notice since they are stored in -debuginfo packages) but no,
> there is no performance penalty since the optimization are active.
>
> The only minor(?) excepton to this is the kernel, where I think there
> is some debugging stuff active in rawhide affecting performances.
>
> --
> fedora-test-list mailing list
> [e-mail]
> To unsubscribe:
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list

[Wietse Muizelaar]

On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 05:47:26PM +0200, Gianluca Sforna wrote:
> On 5/31/07, Niels Weber  wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > 2007/5/31, Oliver Ruebenacker :
> > > I am sure some one has asked this before, but I can not find it: If
> > > I am on F6.93 Rawhide with regular updates and want to shift to F7
> > > Moonshine, what do I need to do? Will it update automatically into the
> > > release version, or will I continue on Rawhide if I do not interfere
> > > with the updates? If I want to end up with the F7 Moonshine release
> > > version, do I need to: (a) do nothing, let the updater do its job (b)
> > > modify the updater (c) boot from an install disk (d) take some other
> > > action. Thanks!
> >
> > considering that regular updating today will already take you past F7
> > and into the new Rawhide, it seems safe to say that you have to do
> > something. I am not sure what though. I guess, one can get a
> > fedora-release RPM somewhere what will do the job?
>
> this should do:
> http://download.fedora.redhat.com/pub/fedora/linux/releases/7/Fedora/i386/os...

Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some more or
less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.

Thanks in advance for your reply.

[Rahul Sundaram]

Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some more or
> less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
>
> Thanks in advance for your reply.

Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the 
time.

Rahul

[Oliver Ruebenacker]

Dear friends,

Same thing happened to me: Automatic update created an F7/F8 mix.
After the updates, all fonts shrank to ridiculously tiny sizes. I
tried to fix it by setting all theme fonts to larger sizes, but some
applications still use tiny fonts, for example the editor of Eclipse,
although it is supposed to use theme fonts. Font selection tool in
Eclipse does not work.

What a pity, I was hoping to have a nice clean full F7 by today,
instead I have a mess. I signed up to test F7T4, not F8. F8 sneaked up
on me.

Downloading F7 now takes forever. ATrpms is currently not responding
at all, which I need to make my wireless working (at least, I think I
do).

There should be an option in yum to revert the most recent updates.
Is there? Thanks.

Take care
     Oliver

On 5/31/07, Rahul Sundaram  wrote:
> Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> > Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> > something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> > fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some more or
> > less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> > which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
> >
> > Thanks in advance for your reply.
>
> Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the
> time.
>
> Rahul
>
> --
> fedora-test-list mailing list
> [e-mail]
> To unsubscribe:
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list

[Michal Jaegermann]

On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 05:36:51PM -0400, Oliver Ruebenacker wrote:
> After the updates, all fonts shrank to ridiculously tiny sizes.

Yes, fonts got shrank.  Not below a wavelength of light but
apparently pretty close to it. :-)

Michal

[Wietse Muizelaar]

On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 05:36:51PM -0400, Oliver Ruebenacker wrote:
> Dear friends,
>
> Same thing happened to me: Automatic update created an F7/F8 mix.
> After the updates, all fonts shrank to ridiculously tiny sizes. I
> tried to fix it by setting all theme fonts to larger sizes, but some
> applications still use tiny fonts, for example the editor of Eclipse,
> although it is supposed to use theme fonts. Font selection tool in
> Eclipse does not work.
>
> What a pity, I was hoping to have a nice clean full F7 by today,
> instead I have a mess. I signed up to test F7T4, not F8. F8 sneaked up
> on me.
>
> Downloading F7 now takes forever. ATrpms is currently not responding
> at all, which I need to make my wireless working (at least, I think I
> do).
>
> There should be an option in yum to revert the most recent updates.
> Is there? Thanks.

Well, what I did after all, was uninstall all the fc8 packages, en
reinstall the fc7-version of those  packages. Costs you some time; but
finally it works the way I wanted.

[Oliver Ruebenacker]

Dear friends,

Wietse, did your fonts shrink, too, and did you get them back to
normal? Thanks!

Take care
     Oliver

On 5/31/07, Wietse Muizelaar  wrote:
> On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 05:36:51PM -0400, Oliver Ruebenacker wrote:
> > Dear friends,
> >
> > Same thing happened to me: Automatic update created an F7/F8 mix.
> > After the updates, all fonts shrank to ridiculously tiny sizes. I
> > tried to fix it by setting all theme fonts to larger sizes, but some
> > applications still use tiny fonts, for example the editor of Eclipse,
> > although it is supposed to use theme fonts. Font selection tool in
> > Eclipse does not work.
> >
> > What a pity, I was hoping to have a nice clean full F7 by today,
> > instead I have a mess. I signed up to test F7T4, not F8. F8 sneaked up
> > on me.
> >
> > Downloading F7 now takes forever. ATrpms is currently not responding
> > at all, which I need to make my wireless working (at least, I think I
> > do).
> >
> > There should be an option in yum to revert the most recent updates.
> > Is there? Thanks.
>
> Well, what I did after all, was uninstall all the fc8 packages, en
> reinstall the fc7-version of those  packages. Costs you some time; but
> finally it works the way I wanted.
>
> --
> Kind regards,
> Wietse
>
> --
> fedora-test-list mailing list
> [e-mail]
> To unsubscribe:
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list

[Wietse Muizelaar]

On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 06:00:45PM -0400, Oliver Ruebenacker wrote:
> Dear friends,
>
> Wietse, did your fonts shrink, too, and did you get them back to
> normal? Thanks!

No, they didn't shrink. At least, I didn't notice. I had some trouble
with NetworkManager, and was able to 'fix' that by downgrading the hole
shebang.

[Niels Weber]

2007/5/31, Rahul Sundaram :
> Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> > Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> > something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> > fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some more or
> > less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> > which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
> >
> > Thanks in advance for your reply.
>
> Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the
> time.

I don't think it is that hard. Just install the fedora-release, then
do a "rpm -qa | grep -i fc8" and replace all those packages listed
with fc7 ones from the repository.

Niels

[Rahul Sundaram]

Niels Weber wrote:
> 2007/5/31, Rahul Sundaram :
> > Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> > > Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> > > something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> > > fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some more or
> > > less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> > > which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance for your reply.
> >
> > Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the
> > time.
>
> I don't think it is that hard. Just install the fedora-release, then
> do a "rpm -qa | grep -i fc8" and replace all those packages listed
> with fc7 ones from the repository.

.. and deal with dependencies being messed up.

Rahul

[Oliver Ruebenacker]

Dear friends,

Why would yum or rpm mess up dependencies if you downgrade? What is
the difference between upgrading and downgrading from a package
managing perspective?

Take care
     Oliver

On 6/1/07, Rahul Sundaram  wrote:
> Niels Weber wrote:
> > 2007/5/31, Rahul Sundaram :
> > > Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> > > > Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> > > > something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> > > > fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some more or
> > > > less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> > > > which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks in advance for your reply.
> > >
> > > Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the
> > > time.
> >
> > I don't think it is that hard. Just install the fedora-release, then
> > do a "rpm -qa | grep -i fc8" and replace all those packages listed
> > with fc7 ones from the repository.
>
> .. and deal with dependencies being messed up.
>
> Rahul
>
> --
> fedora-test-list mailing list
> [e-mail]
> To unsubscribe:
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list

[Oliver Ruebenacker]

Dear friends,

I installed yum-allowdowngrades, I am using the --allow-downgrade
option and I am specifying the full name of the package. Yet, yum
refuses to replace any fc8 package by its fc7 equivalent. If I say
install, yum says nothing to do. If I say update/upgrade, yum says no
update information. What can I do? Thanks!

I was considering remove/install, but some of the packages are
required by maybe about half of the others (such as zlib).

On the other hand, if I wait, will all those fc8 packages be updated
by fc7 packages?

Oh, I just see I still have xsri for fc6. Is that something to be
concerned about?

Take care
     Oliver

On 6/1/07, Niels Weber  wrote:
> 2007/5/31, Rahul Sundaram :
> > Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> > > Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> > > something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> > > fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some more or
> > > less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> > > which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance for your reply.
> >
> > Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the
> > time.
>
> I don't think it is that hard. Just install the fedora-release, then
> do a "rpm -qa | grep -i fc8" and replace all those packages listed
> with fc7 ones from the repository.
> Niels
>
> --
> fedora-test-list mailing list
> [e-mail]
> To unsubscribe:
> https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list

[David]

Oliver Ruebenacker wrote:
> Dear friends,
>
> I installed yum-allowdowngrades, I am using the --allow-downgrade
> option and I am specifying the full name of the package. Yet, yum
> refuses to replace any fc8 package by its fc7 equivalent. If I say
> install, yum says nothing to do. If I say update/upgrade, yum says no
> update information. What can I do? Thanks!
>
> I was considering remove/install, but some of the packages are
> required by maybe about half of the others (such as zlib).
>
> On the other hand, if I wait, will all those fc8 packages be updated
> by fc7 packages?
>
> Oh, I just see I still have xsri for fc6. Is that something to be
> concerned about?
> Take care
> Oliver

Oliver,  Does it work? Are you having any problems? If not why are you
trying to repair something that is not broken?  ;-)

I run Rawhide, the development branch, and I have packages from FC6, F7, and
F8 together and I have no problems.
> On 6/1/07, Niels Weber  wrote:
> > 2007/5/31, Rahul Sundaram :
> > > Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> > > > Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> > > > something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> > > > fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some
> >
> > more or
> > > > less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> > > > which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks in advance for your reply.
> > >
> > > Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the
> > > time.
> >
> > I don't think it is that hard. Just install the fedora-release, then
> > do a "rpm -qa | grep -i fc8" and replace all those packages listed
> > with fc7 ones from the repository.
> > Niels
> >
> > -- 
> > fedora-test-list mailing list
> > [e-mail]
> > To unsubscribe:
> > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list

[Oliver Ruebenacker]

Dear friends,

Yes, I have a problem: After the update, all fonts shrank to such a
tiny size, that it is almost impossible to work. I enlarged all the
theme fonts, but some fonts remained small. I had to enlarge the
terminal fonts separately, and I still do not know how to enlarge the
fonts of the Eclipse editor. Supposedly, the Eclipse editor simply
applies the theme fonts, but it still uses tiny fonts while theme
fonts have been made large. The font selection option in Eclipse does
not work.

And there are a number of other minor glitches, too. Not unusual for
Rawhide, but I would like to have a stable system for now.

Why was I on Rawhide anyway? Well, after trying in vain to set up
IPW3945 wireless on FC6, some one told me that FC6 simply does not
support it and I needed to go to Rawhide. I figured I had to make the
hard choice of either (a) no wireless (b) no Fedora or (c) no
stability. I need my wireless and I thought that if FC6 can not do it,
other Linux distros might not be able to do it either. This was the
beginning of my Rawhide adventure.

At least, I was able to make the wireless work, even if after a lot of pain.

Take care
     Oliver

On 6/1/07, David Boles  wrote:
> Oliver Ruebenacker wrote:
> > Dear friends,
> >
> > I installed yum-allowdowngrades, I am using the --allow-downgrade
> > option and I am specifying the full name of the package. Yet, yum
> > refuses to replace any fc8 package by its fc7 equivalent. If I say
> > install, yum says nothing to do. If I say update/upgrade, yum says no
> > update information. What can I do? Thanks!
> >
> > I was considering remove/install, but some of the packages are
> > required by maybe about half of the others (such as zlib).
> >
> > On the other hand, if I wait, will all those fc8 packages be updated
> > by fc7 packages?
> >
> > Oh, I just see I still have xsri for fc6. Is that something to be
> > concerned about?
> > Take care
> > Oliver
>
> Oliver,  Does it work? Are you having any problems? If not why are you
> trying to repair something that is not broken?  ;-)
>
> I run Rawhide, the development branch, and I have packages from FC6, F7, and
> F8 together and I have no problems.
> > On 6/1/07, Niels Weber  wrote:
> > > 2007/5/31, Rahul Sundaram :
> > > > Wietse Muizelaar wrote:
> > > > > Thnx. Unfortunately, I updated this morning, and there were 117 (or
> > > > > something like that) packages updated; but already with all kind of
> > > > > fc8-suffixes. When I installed this rpm, is it possible in some
> > >
> > > more or
> > > > > less easy way to revert those updates? Now I have a 'mixed' system,
> > > > > which I would like to fix to a fedora7-system.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks in advance for your reply.
> > > >
> > > > Do a clean installation. Reverting will be a pain that's not worth the
> > > > time.
> > >
> > > I don't think it is that hard. Just install the fedora-release, then
> > > do a "rpm -qa | grep -i fc8" and replace all those packages listed
> > > with fc7 ones from the repository.
> > > Niels
> > >
> > > --
> > > fedora-test-list mailing list
> > > [e-mail]
> > > To unsubscribe:
> > > https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-test-list
>
> --
>
> David
>
> --
> fedora-test-list mailing list
> [e-mail]
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