Time to update the hardware?

[Javier Perez]

Hi.
I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.

But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 2013. My
CPU is 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for my
video card. Motherboard uses the H87 chipset.

System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or anything
that really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.

I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon and
should I worry about it...

Appreciate your thoughts on the matter.

JP


-- 
------------------------------
 /\_/\
 |O O|  pepebuho(a)gmail.com
 ~~~~     Javier Perez
 ~~~~          While the night runs
 ~~~~          toward the day...
  m m       Pepebuho watches
                from his high perch.

[Samuel Sieb]

On 3/6/22 22:47, Javier Perez wrote:
>  Hi.
>  I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
>  
>  But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 2013. 
>  My CPU is 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for 
>  my video card. Motherboard uses the H87 chipset.
>  
>  System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or anything 
>  that really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
>  
>  I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon and 
>  should I worry about it...
>  
>  Appreciate your thoughts on the matter. 
As long as it still works for what you need it to do, there's no need to 
replace it.  If it's still the original hard drive, I do recommend doing 
regular backups (of course you should be doing that anyway).

[Ranjan Maitra]

On Mon Mar07'22 12:03:47AM, Samuel Sieb wrote:
>  From: Samuel Sieb <samuel(a)sieb.net&gt;
>  Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2022 00:03:47 -0800
>  To: users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  Reply-To: Community support for Fedora users <users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org&gt;
>  Subject: Re: Time to update the hardware?
>
>  On 3/6/22 22:47, Javier Perez wrote:
>  > Hi.
>  > I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
>  >
>  > But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 2013.
>  > My CPU is 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for
>  > my video card. Motherboard uses the H87 chipset.
>  >
>  > System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or anything
>  > that really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
>  >
>  > I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon and
>  > should I worry about it...
>  >
>  > Appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
>
>  As long as it still works for what you need it to do, there's no need to
>  replace it.  If it's still the original hard drive, I do recommend doing
>  regular backups (of course you should be doing that anyway). 
Completely agree, I have a workstation from 2009 which a student still uses as his desktop
to run basic programs: works fine for debugging and testing before moving it to the
cluster for large tasks. (Yes, it was a good machine in those days.) And a Thinkpad from
2008 which is barely holding on in terms of the lid to the computer but I use it for
simple tasks, mostly video in the exercise room.

And I also use a 2013 Dell XPS 13 (it has a i7 processor) for teaching. That comes under
stress in those times because I have video, audio, recording all running at the same time.
And some coding for demonstration.

As Sam said, if it does what you need it for, I don't see any reason. A 2013 chipset
is likely a x86_64 and will not go out anytime soon.

As an aside, buying new things may have an impact on the environment, even if it is made
to be more efficient, but is used sparingly, then the cost-benefit analysis is somewhat
different. That is my long-winded view and calculation anyway.

Ranjan

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Mon, 2022-03-07 at 01:47 -0500, Javier Perez wrote:
>  Hi.
>  I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
>  
>  But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from
>  2013. My
>  CPU is 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for
>  my
>  video card. Motherboard uses the H87 chipset.
>  
>  System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or
>  anything
>  that really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
>  
>  I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon
>  and
>  should I worry about it...
>  
>  Appreciate your thoughts on the matter. 
My machine is an i3770 from 2014, with a more recent GTX-1050 (and of
course the onboard GPU). The only significant change I've made was to
swap out the HDD for a Samsung SSD. That made a huge difference and I'm
not expecting to upgrade anything in the near term as long as it all
keeps working.

poc

[Jon LaBadie]

On Mon, Mar 07, 2022 at 10:21:05AM +0000, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Mon, 2022-03-07 at 01:47 -0500, Javier Perez wrote:
> > Hi.
> > I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
> >
> > But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from
> > 2013. My
> > CPU is 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for
> > my
> > video card. Motherboard uses the H87 chipset.
> >
> > System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or
> > anything
> > that really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
> >
> > I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon
> > and
> > should I worry about it...
> >
> > Appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
>
> My machine is an i3770 from 2014, with a more recent GTX-1050 (and of
> course the onboard GPU). The only significant change I've made was to
> swap out the HDD for a Samsung SSD. That made a huge difference and I'm
> not expecting to upgrade anything in the near term as long as it all
> keeps working. 
+1

"mums" is my email, dns, and backup server.  "mums" is so named
because
it was my mum's computer.  Mum died in mid 2007.  Don't know how long
mum used it before that.

jl

-- 
Jon H. LaBadie                  jonfu(a)jgcomp.com

[Kenneth Marcy]

On 3/6/22 22:47, Javier Perez wrote:
>  Hi.
>  I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
>
>  But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 
>  2013. My CPU is 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 
>  drivers for my video card. Motherboard uses the H87 chipset.
>
>  System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or 
>  anything that really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
>
>  I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon 
>  and should I worry about it...
>
>  Appreciate your thoughts on the matter. 

The general advice "if it is not broke, don't fix it" or "let sleeping

dogs lie" may be the better overview.

However, a few items might be worth a thought or two. First, dust 
accumulation inside a computer case can blanket components and cause 
overheating. An annual vacuuming and dust-bunny harvest and removal is 
not a bad idea, and exhaust fan attention is the start of cooling system 
review.

Second, are there system board capacities available, but unused? RAM 
expansion? Data storage ports? How many USB 2.0/3.0 ports are available 
and in use? If your desktop has an empty drive bay, would an expansion 
tray for removable digital camera and smartphone cards be useful?

Third, ease of data backup makes it more likely to be done. Is an 
external, removable, drive bay available to facilitate easy copying and 
restoring?

Fourth, does this machine have Wi-Fi or Bluetooth capabilities? Would a 
wireless printer or headphones be useful or enjoyable?

Fifth, are there other devices you might enjoy having connected, 
temporarily perhaps, for specific uses?  For example, hooking an 
electronic keyboard for music composition or learning applications, or 
hooking a drawing tablet for computer-aided design or freehand artwork 
creation might be enjoyable.

The point of this list is that the base hardware likely is capable of 
more tasks than it is now performing, and a little adjustment here or 
there might make it into a more productive and enjoyable piece of 
hardware.  On the other hand, the "do nothing" option is available, 
costing nothing but opportunities.



Ken

[Barry Scott]

>  On 7 Mar 2022, at 06:47, Javier Perez <pepebuho(a)gmail.com&gt;
> wrote:
>  
>  Hi.
>  I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
>  
>  But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 2013. My CPU is 4th
> generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for my video card. Motherboard uses
> the H87 chipset.
>  
>  System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or anything that really
> stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.  
>  
>  I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon and should I worry
> about it...
>  
>  Appreciate your thoughts on the matter. 
I use a rule-of-thumb that hardware over 5 years old is likely to fail under me.

For my file-server/email-server I use RAID enterprise disks with 5 year warranty.
When I'm at the end of the 5 years I replace the server completely.

My main desktop machine is getting old, coming up in 7 years, and parts
keep failing.

The motherboard ethernet died a little while ago and I added a ethernet
card. CPU fan sometime is noisy.

Now when booted into Windows 1 core is 90% busy all the time in
"System Interrupt" process. Fedora thinks the hardware is fine.

Barry



>  
>  JP
>  
>  
>  -- 
>  ------------------------------
>   /\_/\   
>   |O O|  pepebuho(a)gmail.com <mailto:[e-mail]>
>   ~~~~     Javier Perez
>   ~~~~          While the night runs
>   ~~~~          toward the day...
>    m m       Pepebuho watches 
>                  from his high perch.
>  _______________________________________________
>  users mailing list -- users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  To unsubscribe send an email to users-leave(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
>  List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
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> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/[e-mail]
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[Ranjan Maitra]

On Tue Mar08'22 04:20:48PM, Barry Scott wrote:
>  From: Barry Scott <barry(a)barrys-emacs.org&gt;
>  Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2022 16:20:48 +0000
>  To: Community support for Fedora users <users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org&gt;
>  Reply-To: Community support for Fedora users <users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org&gt;
>  Subject: Re: Time to update the hardware?
>
>
>
>  > On 7 Mar 2022, at 06:47, Javier Perez <pepebuho(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  >
>  > Hi.
>  > I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
>  >
>  > But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 2013. My CPU is
> 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for my video card. Motherboard
> uses the H87 chipset.
>  >
>  > System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or anything that really
> stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
>  >
>  > I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon and should I
> worry about it...
>  >
>  > Appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
>
>  I use a rule-of-thumb that hardware over 5 years old is likely to fail under me. 
Mine is that anything is going to fail under anybody at anytime. The warranty does not
recover the actual drive so I keep several copies using rsync. (This helped me once, when
my desktop HDD suddenly failed with a deadline in less than two hours). I rather tensely
booted into one of my spare laptops and was able to continue (luckily I had rsynced a
short while before and it was fairly current) and submit on time. The desktop had a spare
drive (which was copied every hour) but I figured it would take more time to figure that
out.

>  For my file-server/email-server I use RAID enterprise disks with 5
>  year warranty.
>  When I'm at the end of the 5 years I replace the server completely.
>
>  My main desktop machine is getting old, coming up in 7 years, and parts
>  keep failing.
>
>  The motherboard ethernet died a little while ago and I added a ethernet
>  card. CPU fan sometime is noisy.
>
>  Now when booted into Windows 1 core is 90% busy all the time in
>  "System Interrupt" process. Fedora thinks the hardware is fine. 
Right, Fedora is able to handle things better, IMO. I also use openbox and no DE so I feel
a bit more confident, perhaps without reason, that I am subjecting my machine(s) (even the
ones with high resources) to (infinitesimally) less stress. After poking fun of my
"Shunya (zero) distribution" as I call my personal "Fedora remix/spin"
my wife prefers it too because she agrees it is snappier.

Ranjan

[Barry Scott]

>  On 8 Mar 2022, at 16:35, Ranjan Maitra <mlmaitra(a)gmx.com&gt;
> wrote:
>  
>  On Tue Mar08'22 04:20:48PM, Barry Scott wrote:
> > From: Barry Scott <barry(a)barrys-emacs.org&gt;
> > Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2022 16:20:48 +0000
> > To: Community support for Fedora users <users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org&gt;
> > Reply-To: Community support for Fedora users <users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org&gt;
> > Subject: Re: Time to update the hardware?
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> On 7 Mar 2022, at 06:47, Javier Perez <pepebuho(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
> >> 
> >> Hi.
> >> I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
> >> 
> >> But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 2013. My CPU is
> 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for my video card. Motherboard
> uses the H87 chipset.
> >> 
> >> System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or anything that
> really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
> >> 
> >> I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon and should I
> worry about it...
> >> 
> >> Appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
> > 
> > I use a rule-of-thumb that hardware over 5 years old is likely to fail under me.
>  
>  Mine is that anything is going to fail under anybody at anytime. The warranty does not
> recover the actual drive so I keep several copies using rsync. (This helped me once, when
> my desktop HDD suddenly failed with a deadline in less than two hours). I rather tensely
> booted into one of my spare laptops and was able to continue (luckily I had rsynced a
> short while before and it was fairly current) and submit on time. The desktop had a spare
> drive (which was copied every hour) but I figured it would take more time to figure that
> out. 
Oh yes hardware can fail at any time. Indeed I had an in warranty drive fail after 9
months.
And a power supply fail after 13 months

My rule of thumb is really based on by experience that after 5 years the probability of a
failure rises
and I update kit to reset the risks.

Between RAID and regular off-site backups I hope to survive the worst events.


>  
> > 
> > For my file-server/email-server I use RAID enterprise disks with 5
> > year warranty.
> > When I'm at the end of the 5 years I replace the server completely.
> > 
> > My main desktop machine is getting old, coming up in 7 years, and parts
> > keep failing.
> > 
> > The motherboard ethernet died a little while ago and I added a ethernet
> > card. CPU fan sometime is noisy.
> > 
> > Now when booted into Windows 1 core is 90% busy all the time in
> > "System Interrupt" process. Fedora thinks the hardware is fine.
>  
>  Right, Fedora is able to handle things better, IMO. I also use openbox and no DE so I
> feel a bit more confident, perhaps without reason, that I am subjecting my machine(s)
> (even the ones with high resources) to (infinitesimally) less stress. After poking fun of
> my "Shunya (zero) distribution" as I call my personal "Fedora
> remix/spin" my wife prefers it too because she agrees it is snappier. 
Provided your hardware has good thermal design then that variation in load will not
matter.
Run at 90% CPU 24x7 works for years (without reboot with some users).

I have worked on hardware/software appliances where we learned the hard way that the
thermal design is critical to getting a very low RMA rate. We had the software monitor
the
temperature within the product and shut it down when it was in danger of going out of
spec.
This was a while ago and it was the HDD's that failed first. Once you get to the
rated
temperature max for a HDD its life can be measured in days.

Also I note is that we found that early hardware failures could be weeded out by using a
24 hour burn in period.

Barry


>  
>  Ranjan
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[George N. White III]

On Mon, 7 Mar 2022 at 02:47, Javier Perez <pepebuho(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:

>  Hi.
>  I am using Fedora 35 and everything  is working fine in general.
>
>  But I was checking out my hardware and I realized that It is from 2013. My
>  CPU is 4th generation intel and I am using the nvidia-470 drivers for my
>  video card. Motherboard uses the H87 chipset.
>
>  System is being used for regular home use, no extreme gaming or anything
>  that really stress it out. Occasional ffmpeg usage.
>
>  I just wonder if this combination will become obsolete anytime soon and
>  should I worry about it...
>  
>  Appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
>  
10 years ago, desktops provided larger and faster storage than laptops,
more RAM, and better
graphics.

I have an even older desktop core i7 system upgraded with an SSD after
the 2nd hard disk died.  For
many of my needs it is only a bit slower than current core i5 laptops.  For
me, the display quality and
convenience of laptops made in the last 2-3 years means the desktop is no
longer used regularly.
A laptop can be used to view repair manuals next to a broken whotsit,
recipes in the kitchen, etc. so
If  you live in an area with frequent power outages, laptops don't require
a UPS.   Recent Intel integrated
graphics is good enough that many users won't miss an older desktop
graphics card.

Linux users can benefit from the abundance of 2--4 year old laptops that
don't support Windows 11.
Businesses are replacing them with newer Intel/AMD models or even Apple
systems using the new
Apple silicon.

-- 
George N. White III